Why Syracuse will be in the ACC in 2012
by 'CuseRugby on Feb 10, 2012 11:18 AM EST
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PrintI’m sure we would like to get moving during the 2012 season, but we all know it comes down to the financials. Below I've run the numbers and it just makes sense to follow WVU and leave this year:
New ACC Contract ($/Team): $14 million (could be up to $15 million)
Current BE Contract ($/Team): $3.7 million (Side note: AHAHAHAHHAAH)
There is also a benefit to the existing ACC members because of this new tv contract that would start as soon as Pitt and Syracuse come aboard. This would total $24 million per year (The old contract was ~$12million each). If they put some of that towards Pitt and Syracuse coming in, let’s say $9.7 million each, it just might work.
.
.
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Expected buy out cost:……………………$20 million
Difference in contract value:……………...$10.3 million
Possible ACC contribution:……………...$9.7 million
-——————————————————————————
Actual cost to Syracuse and Pitt: ………$0
Additional $ to ACC:………………………$4.6million-$18.6million
………………………………………………(Per School: $329k – $1.33million)
Screwing the Big East -………………….Priceless
This doesn't include any reduction in our buyout fee due to WVU leaving the schedule all funked up, but this basically seems like this is the worst case scenario and the ACC/Syracuse/Pitt are still making money.
Let’s get going!
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voted no becaue I don't think the ACC will really chip in $10M each for us and Pitt
But if the ACC is willing to do that, then I’d go for it. I wouldn’t do any 2012 buyout that doesn’t nearly pay for itself within two years, or any 2013 buyout that doesn’t nearly pay for itself within one year — though I’m certain the Big East really actually wants us to leave in 2013 now; scheduling 8 games with 11 teams is somewhat less wonky than doing so with 13.
The point was
even if the ACC pays $10 million each, it’s getting more $$ in return.
http://www.syracuserugby.com/
Plus if we leave sooner
They could have more leverage in the contract, for a little bit more money, and less of a duration between renegotiating.
Don't think
it’ll happen. WVU leaving is perfect for the big 12. They can slot WVU and TCU into Missouri and Texas A&M’s spots and boom it’s done. There’s no messing with it. With the ACC they’re ADDING 2 teams which makes the football schedule unwieldly. With football schedules coming out very soon I don’t see how the ACC pulls it off this close to spring practice. They can’t add an another conference game because some teams like BC already have 4 non conference games scheduled. Not going to happen. Not this year anyway. I would be shocked if Cuse and Pitt get out for this year.
Makes sense
I hope our buyout fee drops significantly in 2013 if that’s the case.
http://www.syracuserugby.com/
ACC was smart
They made two schedules I believe.
The Big East made one too
Rutgers get to play with itself 2 times next year.
http://www.syracuserugby.com/
by 'CuseRugby on Feb 10, 2012 12:03 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
The ACC
has said they will play 9 conference games.
“When Pitt and Syracuse join the ACC, the league will play a nine-game conference schedule. The format will consist of each team playing all six in its division each year, plus its primary crossover partner each year and two rotating opponents from the opposite division. This six-year cycle allows each team to play each divisional opponent and its primary crossover partner six times (three home and three away) while also playing each rotating crossover opponent two times (one home and one away).”
http://www.theacc.com/genrel/020312aaa.html
So are they going to make each school buyout of a game this year because most have 4 non conference games already scheduled? That’s a lot of lost money. Obviously the schools aren’t going to cancel a home game (lose the home revenue) so they are going to have pay a buyout to get out of a road one. Some teams like Clemson are going to have to drop a home game because they have 4 non conference games and none on the road.
I don’t think the schools are going to go for that unless the ACC gives them a home ACC game in return. What a mess that would be from a scheduling standpoint. How could the ACC have made two schedules? Are they only playing 8 conference games? I don’t think GT is going to not play Georgia this year because Cuse and Pitt want to get in this year.
VT plays at Pitt this year so that scenario is also awkward.
by krackatoan on Feb 10, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Or the pragmatic solution
Play 8 conference games next year, and just make it work for one year.
I’d have preferred a poll that just asked should Cuse leave the Big East period.
NO! Very sad to lose the rivalries.
moo
I'm sad to lose the rivalries, but I'm more than ready to abandon this sinking ship.
I want SU to be relevant and successful more than I want to uphold some rivalries.
Clear eyes, full bologna sandwiches!
Depends on your perspective
If your primary sport is hoops, then yes, those rivalries are sad to see go. If you are a football fan first, there were no longer any real rivalries. Biggest game was WVU, but before BC, Tech, and Miami left, one could argue that they were much bigger “rivalry” games than WVU. Rutgers? Not until Shiano. UConn? Not until Edsall. And now look.
Give me a good ACC team (almost any ACC football team) over a Louisville or Cincy any Saturday, please.
I don’t think we’ll be too sad when we play G’town and / or UConn OOC in hoops while we also have Duke and NC on the schedule. As long as we maintain a top national program, I’m willing to let the old stuff go.
I'm ready "rivalry" as
generating top fan interest. Yes, I know the history behind the Schwartz. trophy, but honestly, was anyone crying out for a parade so we could see it?
If you look at who SU has played a lot
here’s who we’ve played at least twenty times (ignoring schools that are now FCS):
Army – 21 games
BC – 46 (11 Big East conference games)
Maryland – 34
Miami (FL) – 22 (10 Big East)
Navy – 27
Penn State – 70
Pitt – 67 (18 Big East)
Rutgers – 42 (18 Big East)
Temple – 36 (10 Big East)
West Virginia – 59 (18 Big East)
Virginia Tech was never a major rivalry, we just happened to both be good in the late 1990s; we didn’t play them much before the Big East, and haven’t since. We played Miami a little bit more, but it was still the same deal. There’s a lot more history with BC and Rutgers (even if most of that history in both cases is somewhat one-sided in our favor) than Miami and Virginia Tech.
that's why I stated the caveat
of reading rivalry as top fan interest matchups, not just the number of meetings. Not the dictionary definition, I’m sure, but how many times did you say “I can’t wait for the Miami game” vs. “I can’t wait for the Rutgers game?” Or even the WVU game back when we were relevant?
I guess I just can’t shed tears if we don’t play Rutgers or UConn on a yearly basis. Obviously, I’m more of a football guy. I admit the Cuse and G’town could both be 0 -15 in hoops and we’d still want to rip each other’s throats out. But a lot of that comes from us both being good for so many years.
Well, there's pretty much no history with UConn football, either
We didn’t start playing them until they moved to FBS and joined the Big East. Which is the same thing we had with VT & Miami, except that for a while were both good instead both being bad with UConn. Cinci, Louisville, and USF were the same deal — we rarely (or never, in USF’s case) played them before they joined the Big East in football, and I expect we rarely will after we leave.
I started following Syracuse athletics in the early 1990s, so I don’t really know what fans really cared about pre-Big East. And since I’d only just moved to Syracuse then, like any front-running teenage kid I was most excited about the VT and Miami games. But the 1990s was only one small slice of the history of Syracuse athletics, and historically WVU and Pitt have been way more important than VT and Miami to us.
I consider our football rivals, as much as we have them, to be Penn State (even though I’ve never seen a competitive SU-Penn State game), Pitt, and WVU. With BC taking on added importance in the ACC (and maybe Maryland as well), especially if it’s difficult to routinely schedule WVU or Penn State out of conference in the future (which it probably will be). GERG-era notwithstanding, Rutgers just isn’t good enough to be considered a rival. And we just don’t have much history with anyone else that’s still in FBS.
I REALLY HOPE that fox/nbc or something wins the Big12 negotiations
if you think about it, ESPN owns the ACC. BUT, if Fox bids pac10 money to Big12, and says if you get FSU/Clemson etc to jumpship we will pay even more ESPN will HAVE to renegotiate in order to protect their content. Didnt espn or fox do this when Texas was about to leave? They threw the Big12 more money so that it was closer to fair market value and made everyone happy?
That being said, lets get out of the BE ASAP.
by OrangeinJersey on Feb 10, 2012 12:11 PM EST reply actions
Should we get ourselves out ASAP?
Abso-fricken-lutely As it’s been pointed out, though, it’s more a matter of making it possible for the other teams. If SU and Pitt both chipped in an extra $5 Mill or so on top of the numbers already posted that give an actual cost of nothing, I’d be all for it.
Isnt our buyout grandfathered in under the 10mil it was previously?
I don’t see any need to rush it. Im pretty sure its going to come down to whatever is fiscally the most responsible decision for the university, even if WVU gets out.
I dont see loyalty playing into it at all, at this point. We are already out the door, so theres no point in pretending loyalty has anything to do with it.
Syracuse paid $5M to GRob for him to leave Syracuse
I think SU can do something similar for the Big East.
Oh, look at me! I'm making people happy. I'm the magical man from. Happyland in a gumdrop house on Lollipop Laaane! Oh, by the way, I was being sarcastic.
Your math looks solid
I’m just curious as to your sources on the prostective TV contract figures. It looks pretty, but doesn’t mean jack if all the numbers are bull.
"If I ain't gonna be part of the greatest, I gotta be the greatest myself." Busta Rhymes
I haven't seen the ACC/ESPN put a firm # out
But there are multiple sites where they suggest the $2million bump per school:
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/pittsburgh/s_760984.html
Multiple ACC sources said the conference’s new TV deal is expected to be 15 years, with each school making an extra $2 million per year.
http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2012/02/06/Colleges/ACC-TV.aspx
Under the new terms that are being negotiated, each of the ACC’s 14 schools can expect at least $14 million to $15 million a year, sources said, depending on how negotiations between the conference and ESPN conclude.
http://www.syracuserugby.com/
The price has been set
Now it’s just a matter of negotiating who’s paying for what.
I’ve never been a big fan of two week notices at the office either.
I've been involved in a number of cults, both as a leader and a follower. You have more fun as a follower. But you make more money as a leader.
You got it
"If I ain't gonna be part of the greatest, I gotta be the greatest myself." Busta Rhymes
by FeloniousPhunk on Feb 10, 2012 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
This is such a disaster
I think it’s unlikely we’re in the ACC next year, b/c the ACC schedule would get all screwed up. So, I’m prepared for a really weird FB schedule next year. Maybe we’ll Vassar away or something. If BSU doesn’t join, which I doubt they will, there really aren’t enough FBS teams available for to complete a full schedule. Again, Marianatto has managed to screw over the remaining BE FB members. Oh, and apparently the cash money from the WVU settlement is going to pay the MWC for BSU’s exit fee. Great.
Take a look at this article from Luicci from the NJ Star Ledger detailing this mess.
http://www.nj.com/rutgersfootball/index.ssf/2012/02/rutgers_scrambling_to_fill_two.html
Any guesses who gets to travel? (sarcasm)
The Big East’s hope would be to slide Boise State into West Virginia’s spot in terms of the league schedule — which would have Rutgers at Boise, since the Knights were scheduled to go to Morgantown, W. Va. — but the person said Rutgers is demanding that the league re-do the entire league schedule in that scenario. Rutgers would want Boise to come to Piscataway.
http://www.syracuserugby.com/
We should be able to refuse
Playing at a school we didn’t vote to allow in.
Agreed.
How is it we’re still members of the Big East, but can’t vote on anything?
I also hate leaving the Big East and losing the hoops rivalries. But I realize this is a bell we can’t un-ring.
Dedicated Syracuse Orange, New York Yankees, New York Jets, New York Knicks and New York Rangers fan. Riding and dying with 'em.
by That Guy Mel on Feb 10, 2012 5:35 PM EST up reply actions
Hate to bear bad news
But we would’ve been scheduled to go to WVU in the coming year.
by YankeeMePleeze on Feb 11, 2012 6:05 PM EST up reply actions
This argument
Isn’t just about a buyout. If it was, SU would probably just pay it. It’s the 27-month waiting period stipulation. Violating that puts us in violation of our contract with the Big East, which means they could potentially sue us — and I’d assume that the amount we’d have to fork over in that case would be more than any buyout.
I think they come to a settlement for us to leave after the 2012-13 season, though. Especially if WVU leaves this year.
All about ACC (Plus SU & Pitt) football: http://atlanticcoastconvos.wordpress.com
Follow me on Twitter: @JohnCassillo
Well
It’s a settlement. You can always settle before a lawsuit is filed. It just never seems to work out that way in real life…
http://atlanticcoastconfidential.com/
It is about the buyout
Ever since this whole thing started, it was never about the 27 month waiting period. It’s always been about how much Marinatto can extort from the exiting universities to get out of the 27 months. Now that the price is set, hammering out the other details is the painless part.
"If I ain't gonna be part of the greatest, I gotta be the greatest myself." Busta Rhymes
by FeloniousPhunk on Feb 13, 2012 3:51 PM EST up reply actions
If you are the Big East
Wouldn’t it be better to get $40 more million from Pitt and Syracuse. The football teams can just play a round-robin. Home and home. Solves everyone’s scheduling problems. Meanwhile—each team gets an extra $2.5M. That’s 2/3 of the TV revenue. Throw West Virginia’s in and that is like an extra year. Plus, if you do it now, there are less schools to divide up the money.
I’d like to see us get in earlier just to get it over with. But $20M is a lot of money. Especially when it is probably $10M next year. If we loaned ourselves the money from the endowment (as an example)… and paid back $1m a year for 22 years. It would be awfully hard to justify in that 22nd year why it was so important to pay an extra $20M to get one more year in the ACC.
So, in the big picture, it probably does not make sense.
http://atlanticcoastconfidential.com/
Once WVU leaves I believe ESPN can re-negotiate the tv deal
And if that’s a done deal, like has been reported, then the TV deal is already f’ed. So you may as well get some more money from Cuse and Pitt.
http://cusepulp.blogspot.com/
by Lots of Pulp on Feb 12, 2012 8:47 PM EST up reply actions
Seriously,
dump that money into facilities upgrades.
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