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Jim Boeheim Is Not Happy With Rebounding - And He Shouldn't Be

"There is just no excuse the way we are rebounding right now. It's a team effort; it's everybody, it's not one guy. Right now, I don't think we're a good basketball team because we can't rebound." - Jim Boeheim, after the Georgetown game Wednesday.

I say this as a Syracuse University fan, alum, and basketball fan in general: The Orange will not win a national championship this season if they cannot rebound.

By now we all know the gory details. In the loss to Notre Dame, the Orange were outboarded by a gruesome 37-24 margin. These are the same Fighting Irish who lost their best player, 6'8" forward Tim Abromaitis, to a season-ending knee injury. This is a team who only has one legitimate big man in their regular rotation, "The Grinch" Jack Cooley. (You see, because he tried to destroy Christmas… ahem.)

But more on Cooley in a minute.

They righted the ship, at least temporarily, against Cincinnati. However, that was a slim 36-35 edge that looks more like an aberration than a positive sign as that game gets further in the rearview mirror.

SU then resumed their rebounding slump against West Virginia, losing that battle 41-20. Yikes. They coulda-shoulda lost the game as well, but we all know what happened there.

The Orange looked to bust out of their board slump against a very young St. John's squad, and rightfully did so with a 38-25 advantage. SU's domination of the glass led to several exciting fast breaks, including a dunk by Michael Carter-Williams that fans are still talking about.

(via ericmandelkern)

Star-divide

However, against Georgetown Wednesday night, it was more of the same old. Even though they pulled out the win in overtime, the Orange got smeared all over the Carrier Dome glass to the tune of a whopping 48-30 deficit. That's -18 rebounds. I know this because I stared at that number for about ten minutes before starting to write this column.

"It's been a problem all year - rebounding," SU forward Kris Joseph said. "We're just going to have to do a better job of locking on that."

Joseph said that to the Post-Standard's Donna Ditota on January 21, after the Notre Dame game. So it isn't like this issue is news to them.

It was easy for SU fans to blame the ND loss on Fab Melo's absence. Volumes have been written about why # 51 is important to the Orange on both ends of the floor. But I'm going to let you in on a dirty little secret.

They would have lost that game with or without him.

Melo averages 7.6 points and 5.6 rebounds per game, so if you do the math you know that he wouldn't have singlehandedly made up for the 13 board deficit against the Irish. The aforementioned Mr. Cooley - and after the way he manhandled the Orange last month, he deserves to be called "Mr." - put 17 points and 10 rebounds on Melo's replacements, an increase over his season averages of 11 points and 8.6 rebounds. Even at a listed 6'9" and 250, Cooley is not nearly the caliber of athlete as Rakeem Christmas, Baye Keita, or C.J. Fair. But there he was, bullying his way into the paint and seemingly doing whatever he wanted under the basket. Even though Melo provides a larger post presence than any of his teammates, I'm not convinced he would have been able to turn the tide. Why? Because of our second dirty little secret.

Like Boeheim said, rebounding is a team effort.

One man does not make a great rebounding team. That goes double for teams who play zone defense. You know, like SU. The Orange could trot out Dwight Howard and Kevin Love and still lose the battle on the boards if everyone else doesn't pitch in. Because defenders guard places and not people in a zone defense (and I'm generalizing here), it is commonly accepted that zone teams have a tougher time rebounding than man-to-man teams. The zone makes it more difficult to find an offensive player and box him out.

Difficult, but not impossible.

Rebounding is hard work. You have to be willing to sacrifice for the common good of the team. Bumps and bruises are a way of life in the paint. A player may have to put a body on an opponent so his teammate can freely secure the possession. Guards might have to drop down and mix it up with much larger players in order to come away with the ball. But rebounding is the ultimate team-first act in basketball. There are no selfish rebounds. No one will complain if a player gobbles up all of the loose balls. You just have to want it more than the other guy.

There is a tremendous upside to good rebounding. It generates extra possessions. It starts fast breaks, which are the heart of SU's offense. It creates mismatches and easy shots. Guards who rebound get a head start down the floor. Big men who rebound are rewarded for their efforts.

I think this year's team is capable of rebounding, but time is running out for them to prove it.

Rick Jackson made a respectable career off of rebounding. Derrick Coleman had more than anyone else in Big East history. SU coaches know what it takes for rebounding greatness. Now it's up to the players to show how badly they want to be the best team in all the land - and rebounding will be the key.

Jeremy Ryan is a writer and editor for CNYcentral.com in Syracuse. You can follow him on Twitter @JeremyRyan44.

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Great post

This has a been a problem for a long while with this specific group. When this first came up a lot of fans poo poo’d the rebounding by saying “well teams aren’t scoring off the offensive rebounds so it’s ok.” It’s definitely not ok because even if teams don’t score they take time off the clock and slow SU’s transition game down. Georgetown had 4 shots to start the game on Wednesday and by the time Cuse got the ball they had already played defense for the full 35 seconds. Some teams like ND ran off almost 2 minutes(!) on one possession. That starts mentally taking it’s toll and becomes frustrating for everyone. Waiters was so frustrated in that ND game and it definitely affected his play.

I would love to see a time of possession stat for basketball. Cuse has to be near the bottom.

by krackatoan on Feb 10, 2012 12:23 PM EST reply actions  

338 in offensive rebounding?

Gottlieb said we were #338 out of…….what is it…370?

I’m sure it goes hand in hand with T.O.P.

Born in '87, Orange fan since '86

by StealthTurkey on Feb 10, 2012 12:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Defensive is the problem

Statsheet has us at 342 in Def Reb %.
28th in Off Reb %. Which is just bizarre.

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Not really...

we play a zone offense not a zone defense. The three big guys and CJ do particularly good jobs of rebounding on the offensive end. All three big guys have an OR% of 10% or above and CJ is at 8.8%.

by JB44ever on Feb 10, 2012 12:53 PM EST up reply actions  

yeeeaaahhh...

we play zone defense not zone offense…just kidding…

by JB44ever on Feb 10, 2012 12:54 PM EST up reply actions  

But if you accept the premise

That we lack the drive and selflessness to rebound, you wouldn’t expect the OR% to be that high.

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 1:02 PM EST up reply actions  

not neccesarily

I can see why a selfish player will hit the offensive glass hard to get a put back and score points, while on defense they will try to get out in transition quickly to try and score.

That is also consistent with good offensive rebounding and poor defensive.

Also, I think the problem is the guards, not the big guys.

I also maintain the K Jo is killing us with his ball taps. He gets his hand on the ball on the glass, but uses the hand to tap it out to opposing guards, rather than put both hands on the ball

by Pubsky on Feb 10, 2012 4:48 PM EST up reply actions  

The problem is on D...

You’re quoting offensive numbers.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 4:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed except for one bit
They would have lost that game with or without him.

Melo averages 7.6 points and 5.6 rebounds per game, so if you do the math you know that he wouldn’t have singlehandedly made up for the 13 board deficit against the Irish

We have no way of knowing if they would have played the same way. You can’t just add Fab’s averages on to the game and get a result. If we played the way we did, yes, we would have lost. But there’s no guarantee Fab’s presence wouldn’t have changed the way we played.

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 12:33 PM EST reply actions  

How so?
If we played the way we did, yes, we would have lost.

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 1:01 PM EST up reply actions  

I would agree there.

As we’ve seen in the two games Fab has been back, he completely changes the dynamics of the Syracuse defense. Sure, his statistical rebound average doesn’t put much of a dent in the overall margin. But ORebs surrendered are less important than the second chance points that come from those ORebs. With Fab in the middle, there’s a good chance that at least half of those Irish ORebs aren’t converted into second chance buckets.

The OP makes a good point. The rebounding is terrible. But to say that Syracuse lost to ND soley due to weak rebounding is over simplifying. The bigger reason is that the Irish shot 50% from 3pt, and Syracuse shot under 35% overall.

"If I ain't gonna be part of the greatest, I gotta be the greatest myself." Busta Rhymes

by FeloniousPhunk on Feb 10, 2012 1:08 PM EST up reply actions  

You also have to add in

approximately 4 blocks Melo could of had. If you put 3 of those blocks on Cooley’s lay-ups that would have changed the game completely as well. PLUS, if two additional Melo rebounds and two Melo blocks lead to 6 points on the fast break. Well, now your taking approximately 6 points away from Cooley and the Irish (from the blocks/rebounds) and adding 6 points on our score (from possible fast break points) and boom we win by 3. As Mike said, you really have no way of knowing. But two blocks here and two rebounds there for Melo could of changed the game significantly.

by Mike Will is DoubleDown on Feb 10, 2012 3:25 PM EST up reply actions  

it doesn't even make sense to just add points and rebounds to the totals

melo occupies a body or 2, which frees other people up to make plays at both ends. plus, cooley killed us because he was the widest on the court. keita and christmas are both long and lanky and not really able to bang in that style. melo would have neutralized cooley and either the game would have come down to the last shot for one team or SU wins by at least a comfortable 8. no way ND is shooting free throws and playing keep away for the last few minutes.

the general point about our rebounding is absolutely yes, we suck at it. it has to get better and our fast break needs to execute at all times so not to waste those few rebounds we do get.

melo being gone for those 3 games was the best thing that could have happened to this team. obviously, no more pressure of being undefeated. 2 of the 3 games were road games, so that softened the blow of losing to ND and also gave everybody else some important experience going forward. also, losing the first of the 3 and winning the last 2 was the best psychologically, despite the shitty ending to WV.

not that i wouldn’t have loved an undefeated season…

BK: This guy is on fire, he is really smokin'.
KenKo: Oh yeah, Bill? What's he smokin'?

by jlanning17 on Feb 10, 2012 4:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Agree with post but not math

If Melo played in the Notre Dame game and got his rebounding avg., then that means ND wouldn’t have gotten those 7 rebounds and that does make up the 13 differential. However, he did play against G’town, and they were still awful on the boards.

by IKE65 on Feb 10, 2012 12:34 PM EST reply actions  

I think

One of our guard’s has to go for rebounds instead of leaking out. Like straight up, as soon as the shot goes up, crash the boards. I’d settle for fewer fast breaks if we got 10 more rebounds per game.

by fatmofo55 on Feb 10, 2012 12:45 PM EST reply actions  

Agreed

The baseline jumper is the one that destroys this team. Joseph or Fair will challenge and then the 2 guards just stand around while it become 3 on 2 or 4 on 2 in the paint for the rebound. Waiters should be a much better rebounder with his athleticism but he just keeps leaking out. The guards HAVE to rebound. The 3 guards are averaging 6 rebounds a game. That’s pathetic. the way this team forces missed shots they should be averaging nearly 10. The 2003 team had Duany crashing the boards and Edelin was sneaky good at defensive rebounding.

most of the times it’s not the forwards (save for Southerland’s laziness), but the guards that let the team down.

by krackatoan on Feb 10, 2012 1:17 PM EST up reply actions  

(save for Southerland’s laziness)

Just stop. Have you not seen Joseph’s rotations in the zone? THAT’S lazy. And Fair is (statistically) one of our WORST defenders, while Dirty is (by several sources) one of the best.

But back to the rebounding issue, Rakeem and Southerland are the best two defensive rebounders on the team and they get a fraction of the minutes Fair and Joseph see.

So your characterization is wrong. I’m sure you also you the term “Scoopid”. Whatevs.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 4:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Per Luke Winn's exhaustive alaysis

Joseph is the best of the wings defensively.

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 4:17 PM EST up reply actions  

One source. And he used just 15 games.

And the reason Joseph didn’t get dinged more was because his engagement % was lower.

If you watch Kris in the zone, his rotations are half-hearted and when the ball is in the lane, along the baseline, or under the hoop, he starts floating. He’s always trying to leak out. The other wings collapse down.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 4:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Winn's analysis covers points allowed per defensive engagement

A missed defensive rebound that leads to points does not fall on the missed rebounder per Winn’s analysis. It probably falls on “team” or Fab, based on a putback in the paint. It is a weakness of Winn’s analysis re: rebounding.

The Problem with K jo remains that he doesn’t go up and grab rebounds, he taps them out. those tap outs end up going to opposing guards as OR b/c our guards have already tried to leak out on the break.

by Pubsky on Feb 10, 2012 4:53 PM EST up reply actions  

The first point was re: Kris's defense

the Winn analysis doesn’t appropriately knock him for missing a rebound he should get, that is why he shows up as a better defender than the eye test would indicate

The second part was just a tangent, b/c I think he could be a better rebounder if he changed his technique.

by Pubsky on Feb 10, 2012 5:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Gotcha...

I also think “defensive engagements” show that he isn’t actively playing defense. His number there is the second-lowest on the team.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 5:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Did you want to use Winn analysis...

.. and talk about the other points I made? Probably not, huh?

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 4:25 PM EST up reply actions  

You've been busting Joseph and Fair all season

We know you hate them. It’s bizarre. In what world is Southerland a better Defensive Rebounder than Fair?

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 4:31 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't hate them.

But I don’t see the imbalance of minutes they get as warranted (especially Fair). I’d like to see Rak get more of a chance. The whole start the game and then, “Oh you looked at the opposing player wrong, so you’re out of the game” thing is completely idiotic. Also I think the heat Southerland takes (which is what this was about… the “lazy” comment above) is totally bullshit.

As for comparing Fair and Southerland’s DRebs… look at a stat sheet sometime. Fair avgs ONE more DReb a game and gets 10 minutes extra to do it in. Look at Luke Winn’s breakdown (along w/ other stat services), where you’ll see that Rak and Southerland are the best D rebounders on the team.

It’s not really a surprise that we’re ranked so low in rebounding, and can’t keep teams from getting second-chance points when you look at Kris Joseph’s numbers. I guess we gotta pray that he figures it out before tourney time, because IT IS a problem, and there’s no doubt he’s going to continue to get 38 minutes per from here on out.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 4:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Two phrases

1) Sample Size
2) Level of Competition

Fair does his work against the Big East. Southerland has had two good games since Conference play started. I unabashedly love the guy, but he has not been earning his time over Fair or Joseph.

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 4:55 PM EST up reply actions  

On offense...

.. Dirty is definitely struggling. I think it has a lot to do with some off-the-court things, but that’s neither here nor there.

On defense/rebounding though, he’s doing what he’s done all year. His rotations are good, he’s so lanky that he can cover a lot of space quickly, and when he gets there, he’s always got his hands up.

As far as your phrases go, I’m not sure how that applies. I’m pretty certain James has seen action in every BE game this season (as well as the non-con). I’ll give you Rak, but Southerland is avg’ing the same number of minutes in BE play as he did before it. He’s also avg’ing more rebounds per game than he did before conference play started.

So if you’re only going by hitting threes or scoring (and getting into double figures), sure, I’ll agree, Southerland’s only had two “good games”. But if you look at his entire game (playing D, rebounding, making use of his allotted time, etc) I don’t think I could disagree more.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 5:24 PM EST up reply actions  

BTW...

The guy single-handedly kept us in the Notre Dame until he fouled out.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 5:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Also...

Just to point out, the Winn analysis that you refer to adjusts for the phrases you use above.

by Anon5QADEtU4 on Feb 10, 2012 5:37 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't think

You can switch out crashing the boards for starting the break wholesale. This team is built to run. It’s best when its running. It struggles to score when it can’t run. So, the break is just as vital to success as rebounding. But I agree that the guards need to help more, even if they pick their spots. For example, for any shot that goes up inside the 3pt arc and below the FT line, the guards crash. All 3pt and shots above the FT line, they hang back. Again, just as an example. They can’t abandon trying to run off misses altogether, especially since the steal numbers have been trending down of late. The Orange are still forcing TOs, but not as many live ball TOs, leaving opportunities to run rarer.

"If I ain't gonna be part of the greatest, I gotta be the greatest myself." Busta Rhymes

by FeloniousPhunk on Feb 10, 2012 1:26 PM EST up reply actions  

True

But when a 3 is taken the opposite guard HAS to crash the boards. If the on ball guard leaks out that’s fine, but you can’t have both guards above the 3 pt line. That will always put you in a numbers deficit. If the opposite guard crashes and gets the long rebound they can run just as easily. Also Cuse’s wings are so fast and long they will create advantages on the break where most teams can’t.

by krackatoan on Feb 10, 2012 1:40 PM EST up reply actions  

The SU break gets most of its points off of deflections and steals not Defensive boards

I suspect by not leaking out in transition after missed baskets, the team gives up less than 8 transition points a game. On the other hand, they probably give up at least 20 per game in second chance points by leaking out.

by Pubsky on Feb 10, 2012 4:55 PM EST up reply actions  

We have this funny mentality -- I noticed it after the Georgetown game

Where we don’t bother following long jumpers, especially there’s. Which is bizarre mathematically, because it’s not like we’re a particularly strong 3 point shooting team according to statistics. But bam, someone like James Southerland shoots, and mostly every guy on the floor trots to the defensive end. That’s a mentality thing that really needs to be addressed. If Georgetown even won the rebounding battle by 10 instead of 18, the game wouldn’t have been close enough to sweat over. It’s ridiculous.

If you're going to be stupid, you're going to have to be tough

by FatK44 on Feb 10, 2012 12:50 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

This is somewhat zone defense related.

The zone takes a few seconds to set up and if guys aren’t down the court first, then they can’t set up.

And This holds true on both ends of the court. On defense, because a lot of shots are jumpers or threes, the guards are usually already out of position to make a play at the rebound, two players are already leaking towards the half-court line to catch a possible fast break pass, a forward has to make a play at the shooter. All of which leaves the center and possibly one other player in position for a rebound against the 4-5 opponents. Joseph is often cheating down the court when a shot goes up from the other side of the zone making it more of a mismatch.

I've been involved in a number of cults, both as a leader and a follower. You have more fun as a follower. But you make more money as a leader.

by Fly Rodder on Feb 10, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions  

I respectfully disagree

Melo’s presence has a ripple effect and impacts the way the guards play, in how they defend and rebound specifically. That with his better offensive ability I believe could have been enough to make up for the 13 points

http://threeputtbogeys.blogspot.com/2011/10/syracuse-basketball-preview.html

by gimmealoosey on Feb 10, 2012 12:52 PM EST reply actions  

Plus he intimidates other bigs

Look at the game Herb Pope had against him. Pope is a quality big and Fab’s size took him out of his game.

by NoXCUSE99 on Feb 10, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Its remarkable how most of the comments in here are...

defending this team’s rebounding or acting like Fab Melo’s is some kind of god sent rebounding machine. What is wrong with you people? -18 is absurd and shows a horrible lack of effort.

G-Mac bitches

BC 2011

by jdguggs10 on Feb 10, 2012 12:55 PM EST reply actions  

just so we are clear

you disagree with me, Jim and the blogger.

OK

Stop posting.

G-Mac bitches

BC 2011

by jdguggs10 on Feb 10, 2012 1:50 PM EST up reply actions  

I rec'd

because I like handshakes

Troy Nunes Is An Absolute Magician - The Syracuse blog that cares.

If you've got time, buy my book "How To Grow An Orange", visit SeanKeeley.com and follow me on Twitter and Facebook.

by Sean Keeley on Feb 10, 2012 4:09 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t disagree at all with Jim or Jeremy regarding the rebounding. I disagree with the assertion that we know how the team would have played if Fab was available for the ND game. We may have played the same way (flat). Or Fab could have blocked a shot three rows deep on the second play of the game and kept them out of the paint and freed up the wings and guards to extend out on shooters.

None of us (you, me, Jeremy or Jim) know how the ND game would have played out with Fab on the court.

by Mike I. on Feb 10, 2012 2:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Even if the rebounding numbers were the same with Fab

that speaks nothing to how much better the offense seems to flow when Fab’s in the game, as he sets screens, rolls to the basket, gets free for a lob or two a game, and is a good passer off rebounds / in the high post. It’s a fruitless exercise but I for one don’t think they lose to ND without Fab – but like every other speculation about that game, just one man’s opinion.

It's the most bullshit thing I've seen in thirty years.

by Girardi Party on Feb 10, 2012 3:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Melo isn't a rebounding god, but he does drastically effect the quality of the defense overall and, most importantly for this discussion, the quality of opponent's shots.

-18 is unacceptable, but it isn’t purely about lack of effort. We will always rebound worse than we would like because of the zone. That is simply a fact that cannot be overlooked.

Now, is there an effort problem? Certainly, there has to be. The zone hurts us in rebounding some, but not that much. The backline definitely needs to step up their game on the glass.

Clear eyes, full bologna sandwiches!

by NOLACuse on Feb 10, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions  

It's not an effort problem

The players are leaking out looking for fast break points.

It’s a balance problem.

I've been involved in a number of cults, both as a leader and a follower. You have more fun as a follower. But you make more money as a leader.

by Fly Rodder on Feb 10, 2012 1:16 PM EST up reply actions  

I was rewatching the game and one thing with the rebounding stuck out with me

The back line, when not ferociously contesting a shot, ball watches all the time.

Instead of seeing the shot, looking down and finding the man in your zone to box, the team is just watching the ball the majority of the time.

We know factors like leaking out, deficiencies rebounding in a zone, but if they can get body on body when the shot goes up, this would obviously help.

Captain Obvious signing off.

http://cusepulp.blogspot.com/

by desoto86 on Feb 10, 2012 12:59 PM EST reply actions  

Rewatching which game?

If you meant Notre Dame, I give you a lot of credit – you’re a glutton for punishment. I can’t stand to re-watch a loss! Anyone else the same way?

It's the most bullshit thing I've seen in thirty years.

by Girardi Party on Feb 10, 2012 3:08 PM EST up reply actions  

No no, the Georgetown game.

I’m not a sadist here

http://cusepulp.blogspot.com/

by desoto86 on Feb 10, 2012 3:46 PM EST up reply actions  

CAPTAIN OBVIOUS IS RIGHT

NOTICE WHEN KRIS SHOOTS A 3, IMMEDIATELY HE IS OFF DOWN THE COURT, SEEMS TO ASSUME IT IS GOING IN…..HE SHOULD BE RUNNING TO THE BASKET TO CATCH THE REBOUND……….OR……….MAKE EVERY 3!!

by flower on Feb 10, 2012 1:12 PM EST reply actions  

The players are almost like us fans

The other team chucks up horrible shots, and they just assume they will go in based on how lucky our opponents are. Thus they don’t make an effort to rebound, until they see that its actually a miss.

by fatmofo55 on Feb 10, 2012 1:18 PM EST reply actions  

Overall, I agree, the rebounding just has to be better.

But I still believe that this team can win a title with relatively poor rebounding as long as Melo plays. Our defense is great in every other way and teams struggle to take and make good shots when Melo is in the game, even with plenty second-chance opportunities. More important than rebounds is continuing to create turnovers at a rate, IMO. With just a slight improvement in defensive rebounding I won’t be all that concerned because of how effective we are at blocking shots, forcing bad shots and creating turnovers.

Others have mentioned players leaking out for fast-break chances over staying in to fight for rebounds. I think this is a great point and might be the real adjustment needed.

Clear eyes, full bologna sandwiches!

by NOLACuse on Feb 10, 2012 1:19 PM EST reply actions  

Nothing wrong with sending one guy deep while 4 rebound

It’s a great source of offense for us. Half the team booking it down the floor when a shot goes up is a different story though

http://threeputtbogeys.blogspot.com/2011/10/syracuse-basketball-preview.html

by gimmealoosey on Feb 10, 2012 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Yep.

My thoughts too.

Clear eyes, full bologna sandwiches!

by NOLACuse on Feb 10, 2012 1:32 PM EST up reply actions  

the only thing there is

A one man break isn’t very successful. There needs to be someone else with him. So, yeah, there needs to be a crash. But you have to allow for at least two players to leak out at somepoint.

"If I ain't gonna be part of the greatest, I gotta be the greatest myself." Busta Rhymes

by FeloniousPhunk on Feb 10, 2012 1:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Rec'd, +1, THIS, whatever you folks wanna say

Very good research and very good point. Looking at just a flat quantity of rebounds, or sometimes even the head to head rebounding numbers, can be misleading because both teams don’t get the same number of chances on each end – obviously the numbers historically show it’s easier to rebound an opponent’s miss. 18.5% of offensive rebounds against WVU stings worse than the rebounding margin against Georgetown, though the DREB% in those two games are the most cringe-worthy stats on this page.

It's the most bullshit thing I've seen in thirty years.

by Girardi Party on Feb 10, 2012 3:13 PM EST up reply actions  

It's a simple fix really

They need to JUMP FOR IT!!! They stand there and either watch the other team jump for it, or they run the other way. It’s lack of effort on their part. Jump for the god damn ball. It’s that simple. Don’t overthink it!

by Orangelove77 on Feb 10, 2012 11:55 PM EST reply actions  

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