Syracuse vs. Maryland: The Rivalry That Always Should Have Been
by Sean Keeley on Sep 20, 2011 12:15 PM EDT
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PrintIn my podcast discussion with Jim Young at ACC Sports, I surprised them with the notion that I thought the Syracuse Orange and the Maryland Terrapins always should have been big rivals on the basketball court and football field.
In fact, in doing a little internal research, I surprised even myself by realizing I've been calling for it since 2006. My reasoning? Like the world's money supply and the liberal media, my theory involves The Jews...
Let's face facts. Northeastern Jews usually make thier college choices between a few schools. If you're mentally-challenged, you go to West Virginia. If you're female or don't care about sports, you go to Delaware. If you're supersmart, you go Ivy League. The rest of the Flock decide between Syracuse, Maryland and Hofstra. I know from experience...my final two choices were Maryland and Syracuse. Because the Syracuse/Maryland dilemma is one faced by so many Jews in the Tri-State area (New York, New Jersey, Connecticut), there's tons of families, friends and communities with ties to both schools. You've got a built-in rivalry right there. And as for all the goyim, yeah, they can watch too.
Obviously, that's still a small percentage of the two alumni and fan bases, but it gets us down the path of rivalry. Like I said in the podcast, I know a LOT of people back in NJ who either have relatives or friends that went to both schools. Personally, my stepfather went to Maryland. There is a lot of overlap.
In the basketball realm, Syracuse is already entrentched firmly in the DC/Baltimore recruiting world (Carmelo, Donte Greene, etc.). And I'm willing to bet Maryland looks to NY/NJ/PA as well. Tons of crossover there.
The football match-up just got interesting with the arrival of Syracuse alum Randy Edsall. We're already pissed at Edsall for his UConn days and calling Maryland his "dream job." Well, we're actually laughing about that second part, but, you know. Considering Edsall's son Corey is walk-on at SU, we could call it The Edsall Bowl. Winner gets the rights to the other Edsall.
There's history there, too. We've actually played each other 34 times in football (SU leads 18-14-2), most recently in 1994. Maryland famously refused to play against Syracuse when they featured African-American superstar Wilmeth Sidat-Singh (until SU caved). And we played each other in the one and only Cherry Bowl.
Our basketball history is a bit more slight, having met 7 times (Maryland leads 5-2). We played one another in the NIT a few years back. Shame Gary Williams and Jim Boeheim didn't get more opportunities to curmudegeon-off.
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I don't have any evidence
Primarily because I don’t have the patience for research, but it could be that the majority of the meetings took place prior to the Boeheim era. SU basketball wasn’t really shit before then.
"If I ain't gonna be part of the greatest, I gotta be the greatest myself." Busta Rhymes
by FeloniousPhunk on Sep 20, 2011 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Miss-read
I miss read the line “most recently in 1994. Maryland famously refused to play against Syracuse when they featured African-American superstar Wilmeth Sidat-Singh (until SU caved).”
I thought it read that in 1994 Maryland refused to play Syracuse because Sidat-Singh… turns out that this was back in the ’30’s…which makes a little more sense. Regardless I agree 100% about the connection but disagree about the rivalry. I like Maryland too much to hate them… but obviously play a few more times and I will love to hate them. For now thought I’m gonna keep rooting for those little turtles.
Here here!
They always seem to give Miami fits, so I have rooted foe them… And as a card carrying member of the “I hate the ACC”, this is going to be tough.
by PickleTJohnstone on Sep 20, 2011 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions
PS - it's hear hear!
"A new era has dawned in Maryland Athletics..."
by bball purist on Sep 21, 2011 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
And here we are, being helpful and trying to make a nice guide for you to welcome you to the ACC: http://maryland.247sports.com/Board/53/Help-for-Cuse-and-Pitt-Fans-How-to-Hate-the-ACC-4381971/1#a4387374
While I WANT to hate you, it’s hard because you know, Maryland has been the lone yankee school in the ACC (which we nicknamed the All Confederacy Conference eons ago) for so long (BC doesn’t count) it’s weird to have a non truck nuts having ally.
On the other hand, you guys have been in the ACC for two days and are already stealing our shtick. Gary bitched about the ACC tournament in NC for so long that they finally started rotating it when we threatened to go to Paterno’s Eastern Conference or whatever. Every year the tournament just serves as a way (because we’re not winning it anyway) for Maryland fans to make fun of the fact the ACC tournament is sponsored by 1996’s finest: Food Lion, Bojangles, and Waffle House (we are not kidding). If you guys start bitching about Carolina refs tomorrow, so help me god, we will burn your campus down (we are really good at that).
by MarylandMyMaryland on Sep 20, 2011 1:02 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
It's true, b/c it's true
Most of the Terp fanbase is overjoyed at the prospect of adding ‘Cuse and Pitt to get some of our Northern bros in the conference and break up the Tobacco Road monopoly on…EVERYTHING. I’m just hoping that if/when the ACC goes to 16 it adds to more non-drawl schools to the mix so we can have a real North/South division structure.
Waffle House, really?
That’s awesome and sad. If you’re talking about 1996, I guess it’s not much worse than Aeropostale then.
I’m looking forward to the Maryland rivalry picking up. Of course, the ACC will have us playing once every other year in football, and once a year in hoops. I’m really hoping for an ACC North division, with us, you guys, BC, Pitt, UConn, UVA, Va Tech and Rutgers or whoever joins with UConn. That’s a group that belongs in a conference together, althought PSU over Rutgers would seal the deal.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
If you think there's no truck-nut good 'ol boys in Upstate NY...
you’ve never been here before.
The 'Cuse is in tha house, oh my God oh my God.
That's not the same
See, you can draw a line, and most of Western/Central NY, West PA, WV, Eastern KY, Extreme West VA, East TN, and North Alabama are cut of the same kind of cloth with some difference, which is to say Appalachian and Hillbilly in a way. Meanwhile, the ACC is more like the good old boy, dandy, send the kids to England for a few years ilk.
by Nick Petrilli on Sep 20, 2011 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions
exactly!
Anyone remember the D.A. Jim Trotter in “My Cousin Vinny”? That is my vision of a typical ACC fan. Groomed, blue blood gentleman with equal parts charm and distain
by The Invisible Swordsman on Sep 20, 2011 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly
Though NC State definitely is also cut of that same hillbilly cloth more than the rest of the ACC.
by Nick Petrilli on Sep 20, 2011 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm sick of...
…Northern New York not getting its redneck due. I’m talking north of Watertown bathtub in the lawn next to the dressed deer Northern New York redneck.
Lacrosse rivalry should be fantastic.
In Lax We Trust - Official Pro Lacrosse Blog of SBN
Follow me on Twitter - In Lax We Trust
Stewart Mandel once called SU and Maryland the two most insecure fanbases in the country
Jewish self-loathing projected onto all of us or simply an accurate assessment?
Insecure about what?
That seems like a really, really broad statement.
by Nick Petrilli on Sep 20, 2011 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
It was a random mailbag response a couple years back that I still remember
And you’re right. He was suggesting that MD and SU provide him the most grief over lack of adequate press coverage of the programs, lack of due respect to their prestige and championships, etc.
by lemonysnicket9 on Sep 20, 2011 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
I think
this especially applies to Maryland BBall. There is a boatload of tradition at UMD involving basketball going way back, and we barely get mentioned when someone talks about ACC bball. Hell, even the first post here when the switch was made just mentioned playing UNC and Duke now. On top of all the haters who came out when multiple national writers called UMD a “top 10 program” (or whatever) for a bball coach to take over…ugh. Hell, we invented midnight madness! The reason that there is an at-large bid is in large part because of UMD. But no love…no love at all.
I'm pretty sure UNC, Duke, Maryland were the teams mentioned as who we would fight against for championships
But I still don’t understand how Maryland is a Top 10 job.
by Nick Petrilli on Sep 20, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Nah
I always remembered them as more of a team fighting for relevance last year. Weren’t they barely top25?
Born in '87, Orange fan since '86
by StealthTurkey on Sep 20, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
a Terps fan may correct me
But UMD always did well while Lefty Driesel was there in the 70s and 80s – Not sure when he retired, early 90s maybe? After that they had some up and down times until Williams came in and solidified things. I think their recent issues are again coaching transition related.
We will not rest until we see these capitalist octopuses annihilated.
-Che Marrone
Lefty was booted out after Len Bias died. They were a VERY successful team in the non at-large timeframe, but always managed to lose the one big game. (Which goes back to our influence on the at-large bid). Bob Wade sent the program into NCAA hell, and Gary rescued it. Problem w/ Gary was that he didn’t really play the “AAU game” and was a very strict “Gary-type player” recruiter. This caused us to miss out on some really top level talent. His rift with the B’more AAU scene basically caused UMD to get VERY few recruits from it’s own homebase. (‘Melo ring a bell? Hell he’s got an Oriole-colored Impala I believe; Kevin Durant has f’ing “MARYLAND” tatooed across his back!)
Almost exclusively based on the recruiting grounds. If you can get the “DMV” (DC/MD/VA for those who don’t know) kids to stay home, you’ll have a top 10 team every year. It wasn’t based on the actual state of the program as much as “what it could be” in the right hands.
Yeah but the issue with that is there are already teams in that area who are way higher in terms of how they recruit there
I don’t see how it is a better situation than:
UNC
Duke
Kansas
Kentucky
UCLA
Indiana
Syracuse
Louisville
Michigan State
Arizona
by Nick Petrilli on Sep 20, 2011 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Most of the WC teams don’t really recruit here. UNC and Duke don’t really recruit MD all that well, except for DeMatha but that’s another story, they normally farm VA more. Most MD recruits end up going north, not south, for the most part. I don’t think I’ve seen anyone from MD go to IU/L’ville/MSU in recent memory.
How about this, in 4 months on the job, Turgeon already has a Top 10 2012 class, with what looks like another one on the way in 2013. You can doubt all you want, but “facts is facts”.
i go to umd now and an active member on testudotimes our sbnation site
i think the top 10 job thing is a bit different then being a top 10 program. Its two different things. Many analyst feel Maryland is the sleeping giant of the ACC considering our history and lack of success after our natty in 2002. We’re in a area ripe with talent (DMV+BMORE) and are in the same area with some of the top hs and aau programs. For example, i would say Duke isnt a top 10 job because no one can replace coach k, whether coaching or recruiting. Once he retires, there program will get worse (think about it, coach k is getting up there, who’s gonna replace him?). However, Maryland, considering its facilities, trendy-gear, and location should always be a good basketball school no matter who is the HC.
I do kind of hate myself
but pretty sure I could learn to hate Maryland more.
Oh wait, I just remembered I’m awesome. Yeah, I don’t hate myself anymore.
part of it
You have to remember, Maryland is the third winning-est (is that even a word?) program in the ACC behind Duke and UNC. Yet, we’ve always felt the ACC has never given us respect instead choosing to focus on Tobacco Road teams.
by MarylandMyMaryland on Sep 20, 2011 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions
You left out Virginia Tech and Georgia Tech
Being above you.
by Nick Petrilli on Sep 20, 2011 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Stewart Mandel is the biggest tool there is
Pat Forde is an old fashioned gentleman next to that dipsh*t. I remember many years ago, right after we hired Greg Robinson (ugh, that hurt just typing it) and we were cautiously optimistic and relatively excited to see how this would work out.
Anyway, a Syracuse fan writes in to ask him a simple question – something like “Hey Stewart, what do you think of the hire of former Longhorns DC Greg Robinson as head coach of Syracuse?” Simple, straight-forward question, right?
So Mandel answers, “… whoever the coach is, I really can’t get excited about a perennial 6-6 team that plays football in a garage in Upstate New York.”
Really Stewart? You really had to go out of your way to be a total dick instead of just answering a simple question? Or not answering it. You didn’t have to print the question if you didn’t want to answer it. But you went to the extra effort to be a condescending prick. Which sounds kinda insecure to me.
I wish sports columnists today, if they’re so desperate to show people how fucking funny they are, would grow a pair and get on stage at Caroline’s and risk being heckled right off the stage. Wouldn’t bet on that happening any time too soon though.
Can’t wait to hear which sitcom actress who’s totally out of his league Stewart has his official crush on next. Because that’s good journalism right there.
Thank goodness I’m over it and I’m not bitter.
I really don't think most journalists try to be funny
And when they try to be funny they do dad humor. Most just try to act like they know more than everyone else.
by Nick Petrilli on Sep 20, 2011 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
pretty accurate
B4 our squads and Jimmy and Gary won Nattys, both of our programs had MAJOR chips on our shoulders for under-appreciation. Now both schools still carry chips on our shoulders, just not as big – it’s too ingrained to give up.
"A new era has dawned in Maryland Athletics..."
by bball purist on Sep 21, 2011 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Maryland is actually our 9th most played football opponent
7th if you eliminate teams currently in FCS like Cornell & Colgate…. and now you know!
PS: Is “most played” actually a phrase? It doesn’t sound right. I think I may have just made that up…
I'll allow it
Troy Nunes Is An Absolute Magician - The Syracuse blog that cares.
If you've got time, buy my book "How To Grow An Orange", visit SeanKeeley.com and follow me on Twitter and Facebook.
That's right; from the late '50s to the early '80s...
Maryland was a regular on the SU football schedule — the game was usually played in late September or early October, before the Terrapins got into the ACC schedule and the Orange played northeast rivals such as Penn State, Pittsburgh, Boston College and West Virginia.
What was strange was that for many of those years, SU would face both Maryland and Navy at either Archbold/the Dome or on the road. One would have thought Syracuse would have tried to shift one of the series so it would play one game a year in the Washington/Baltimore area.
As a native Syracusan and Maryland alum, I welcome the Orange to the ACC and look forward to seeing your teams take on Randy, Mark and Brenda (Frese, coach of women’s team, 2006 national champions. Maryland ranks among the nation’s attendance leaders in women’s hoops).
The only thing I know about MD,
is that they party like its the end of the world every night of the school year.
SU 97
ESPN headline currently on front page: Boeheim will miss Tourney in NYC
In other news, the sun also rises.
http://www.jasonaldean.com/video/3_behind_the_scenes/my-kinda-party-acc-football
This is our shared reality now. United we stand.
by MarylandMyMaryland on Sep 20, 2011 1:35 PM EDT reply actions
I take it
you’re NOT attending the 2011 ACC Fan Fest headed by Dierks Bentley?
by MarylandMyMaryland on Sep 20, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll take Biz Markie
That man has talent.
Born in '87, Orange fan since '86
by StealthTurkey on Sep 20, 2011 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Whoa Whoa Whoa
My neighbor works with Biz. He still does DJing and other random crap like that kids TV show. And no, I’m really not kidding. Biz is an awesome dude to hang with.
I was serious.
I love Biz. He’s awesome! Yo Gabba Gabba is the show you are referring to!
Born in '87, Orange fan since '86
by StealthTurkey on Sep 20, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Get used to it
The ACC has the WORST music promotions or tie-ins, or whatever you want to call them, that I’ve ever heard.
Also hoping that with the addition of ’Cuse and Pitt, that the conference bball tourney can be… sexier. The Big East tourney is so much better than the crap that the ACC puts on.
Youre logic
about the Jews is sound. It also applies to North Eastern Asians. Every Asian-American I met while at SU (a lot because my roommate worked at blue monkey) had it down to SU and MD. My brother lived with three Asian kids who all like MD. Also in my freshman writing class, the 4 Asian students all bonded over the fact that they did not get into MD because they were out of state.
May Doug Marrone bless you and keep you.
I picked Maryland over Syracuse, but when I got to Maryland, the first two friends I made were kids I recognized from my tour group at Syracuse.
by MarylandMyMaryland on Sep 20, 2011 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions
hahahaha that's funny.
Too bad the only turtles I like happen to be ninjas…..
Born in '87, Orange fan since '86
by StealthTurkey on Sep 20, 2011 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm not Jewish, but my Jewish friends at UMd told me in the '70s...
…the three big colleges for most Jews were Syracuse, Maryland and American University in northwest D.C., which of course doesn’t field a football team.
and Miami was the fallback U in the 70s - lol
"A new era has dawned in Maryland Athletics..."
by bball purist on Sep 21, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
er, Sean
if it was just about having huge Jewish student populations, Rutgers and Syracuse would be bigger than Alabama/Auburn.
Interesting.
None of my Jewish friends went to Syracuse OR Maryland, and I’m friends with a handful of SU and MD alumni (including lacrosse players on both teams)!
at least one to Duke or Michigan!!! I bet I win the guess
"A new era has dawned in Maryland Athletics..."
by bball purist on Sep 21, 2011 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
How harsh
were Cuse’s rivalries with BC, PonziU and FSU before they split?
Prepare for the sheer enjoyment of the clever little Cameron Cheer Sheet ‘crazies’ on an annual basis.
How close is Boeheim to calling it a career?
VPI, not FSU
I’ve always been a basketball first guy, and the basketball rivalries with those schools were non-existent. As for football, I’m not sure we really had harsh rivalries with any of them. There were a lot of competitive games with BC & VT, and Miami usually blew us out (they usually blew out most Big East teams when they were with us). To be honest, the harshest the BC rivalry got was probably the last year before they left for the ACC (ask BC fans about the “Diamond Ferri” game).
And if I had to guess, I’d say Boeheim will be around for 3-4 more years. But it’s just a guess.
Shut up brain or I'll stab you with a Q-tip
Cherry Bowl I
Actually, Michigan State played Army in the first Cherry Bowl in 1984. I was there; it was magical. A mardi gras wrapped up in Christmas packaging and lit by independence day fireworks. Wahoo!
by Sparty_Cyclone on Sep 21, 2011 10:22 PM EDT reply actions
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