NCAA Admits Backcourt Violation Call Was Incorrect. Syracuse Fans Feel So Much Better.
by Sean Keeley on Mar 22, 2011 6:27 PM EDT
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So there you go, the back-court violation call on Scoop Jardine late in the Syracuse-Marquette game was officially deemed incorrect.
Alrighty.
It's a gesture from the NCAA but an empty one at best. Especially when NCAA officiating coordinator John Adams says the play was not reviewable anyway. Thanks, John Adams. So basically what you're saying is you're officials made a terrible call on what should be a very straight-forward basketball rule but even if it was evident at the time that it was a bad call, it couldn't have been overturned anyway because, well, who the hell knows.
Does Syracuse win the ballgame if this call doesn't get blown? We'll never know. It certainly killed the Orange's momentum at that moment and took the game out of their hands.
That said, it still doesn't excuse Scop Jardine for not knowing the backcourt rule either. Scoop said afterward that he knew it was a backcourt but if you look at his body-language when catching the ball, that's clearly not the case. I went over this in the game recap but suffice to say, Scoop's reaction and lack of basketball acumen played a part in why the violation was called.
The larger discussion here is what seems to be the alarming rate of important NCAA basketball games that are having their outcomes irrevocably altered by poor referring. The Rutgers-St. John's Big East game, the Syracuse-Marquette game and the Pitt-Butler game immediately come to mind and I know there's a dozen more. Was it always this bad? Probably. But every time it happens, it seems like the only thing the fans, teams and NCAA can do are shrug their shoulders and do nothing.
Bring on the robot referees, already.
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Pitt/Butler game
was not poor officiating, those were the correct calls. And even if you deem them incorrect, Pitt would’ve lost either way, so the outcome was not altered.
However, this year has definitely been horrible for refs, they really need to find some way to fix it, because its difficult to watch at times.
I was just going to say this
I was glad the refs didn’t swallow their whistles for Pitt Butler the way they did for Rutgers/ St. Johns. But from November to today, this was the worst season I can remember watching college basketball. Not just Syracuse, but so many games around the Big East especially were depleted in their enjoyment by utter incompetence and inconsistency by the officials.
Your First Ever Pinstripe Bowl Champions- The Syracuse Orange
by bigbluethruandthru on Mar 22, 2011 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions
What was wrong with Pitt/Butler?
Those were both good foul calls. The concept of swallowing the whistle isn’t in the rulebook – refs should call any foul or violation that gives one team an advantage over the other no matter how much time is on the clock.
Scoop may have caused the ref to blow the whistle on this one
But HORRIBLE throw in by Dion. If you blame Scoop for not being really aware that he could have landed with 1 foot in backcourt (not sure how you can, hard to think that quickly), then you have to blame Dion for making a bad pass.
How was it horrible?
Look at Scoop’s body. He is two feet off the ground and has his arm fully extended to snare it. I am no physicist (so much so that I don’t even know if a physicist is the person who would solve a question like this), but doesn’t it seem that Waiters’ throw would have landed several feet behind the midcourt line if Scoop had just let it land. Plus, it’s not like there was any danger of the other guy getting it if Scoop did that.
Dictated, but not read.
The pass
Didn’t have to be thrown that hard at the spot it did? Scoop had some space from his defender…I (think) he could have thrown it without making Scoop reach for it. I’d have to watch it again, but I thought Dion threw it pretty hard. At the angle/velocity he threw it Scoop would have had to run it down pretty hard. If Dion throws it right in Scoop’s chest, Scoop catches, turns, with a foot behind the midcourt line. He doesn’t have to reach and lunge for it either…
by SyracuseBills on Mar 23, 2011 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions
It seems to me that part of the reason Scoop lunged for the pass was because he didn't realize he could just run and catch it.
The pass maybe wasn’t perfect, but it certainly wasn’t horrible either.
Scoop should know the rule intuitively before that throw-in...
Like knowing you can run the baseline or pass out of bounds after a made basket. These are the things that separate smart players from average players.
Whenever you watch a ncaa or even nba game you see players do the same thing though. They either try to catch it in the backcourt or in the front court. Hardly anybody ever catches it the way that Scoop “should” have. Also it seems like he was taking an angle such that he didn’t think he could get to the ball if he went to catch it all in the back court.
I'm confused...
I thought we just got done saying that one single backcourt violation did not cost us the game – our inability to avoid the charge call, ridiculous turnovers (including that play), and general inability to either get the ball to Jackson or take advantage of the double team cost us the game? I also thought we just got done spending two days noting that Scoop very likely traveled anyway? Now the NCAA says “my bad on that call” and we are back to “we’ll never know what the outcome of this game would have been if only they hadn’t blown that call…”?
I agree that there have been a lot of glaringly awful calls this year, but let’s not take the next step back into the darkness. Also, I would be much MUCH more pissed if I was a Texas fan right now. That was an awful call. It seemed like the ref was just waiting to make the call and was not going to be denied.
It went both ways...
Look, the refs blew this call, they also missed the fact that Scoop travelled on this play and more importantly the blatant technical foul that should’ve been called on Fab Melo earlier. Refs make mistakes. The Jim Burr/Tim Higgins blown call in the Big East tournament was atrocious. As was the 3 second 5 second count (another Burr crew) in the NCAA’s. The refs missed some calls in this game, but I don’t think this was even in my top 20 of worst-called SU games of the season.
For real-time 'Cuse banter, check me out at: http://twitter.com/#!/TeabagDunk
not that it matters...
But I don’t think it was a travel. The rule does say that the foot that the player lands with is supposed to be the pivot. However, Scoop did not have possession when his foot landed, so it’s unlikely a travel would apply there.
Someday the NCAA....
will can a Ref for incompetence………………………….HAHAHAHA! had you going there for a second!
Nothing Is Fool proof if you have the right fools.
Ref should know the rules – especially simple straightforward calls. It doesn’t really matter what Scoop did. If the ref is making calls based on how a college player acts, he’s not a good ref. Oh well..
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"Hockey is the only job I know where you get paid to have a nap on the day of the game." - Chico Resch
by Matthew Ventolo on Mar 22, 2011 9:41 PM EDT reply actions
Agreed
Upon further review, it’s not even close. But, at fast speed, I thought the first foot landed in bound and the second foot landed in the back court. And, apparently, I was just hallucinating.
Of course, CBS…errr… TruTV did not give us any good replays. Maybe I de-hallucinated that.
Still, the ref was not watching it on TV with me… he was right there. If you aren’t sure it is a backcourt violation, how about NOT call it?
Nevertheless, as others noted, I knew we were in trouble when Marquette was playing like crap and we were up by 10, rather than 16 due to sloppiness. Just another game where this team had an opponent down and failed to just put them out of their misery. Sure, we’ll always have Colgate and DePaul… but good teams are going to make a rally. Better put them away while you can.
Dictated, but not read.
yeah, it doesn't matter
you need 3 points established to be in the front court: both feet and the ball
I'm sure the title is sarcastic, but I'm not.
This actually makes me so much worse. Though now I can vent my anger on someone not named Scoop.
18 Turnovers.
Including one by an upperclassmen which he followed with the most pointless and mindless case of prompting the “X” being thrown up in history.
Seriously, that was at least a 4pt swing, maybe a 6-7 if we had scored on that possession.
I love KJo, but that turnover and foul was as embarrassing for me as a Cuse fan as Punting on 3rd down was.
The 'Cuse is in tha house, oh my God oh my God.
The intentional was dumb
Real dumb, but he wasn’t the one who caused it. Triche threw one of his now patented weak passes to nowhere, which caused the snowball that caught fire.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Mar 22, 2011 10:54 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think
the intentional will go down as the Terrance Roberts backboard slapping play of this game. We win without both of those things happening.
Without Gerry McNamara we wouldn't have won 10 f-- games, not 10
by PoetryInMoten on Mar 22, 2011 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Well that makes it worse
Its one thing when a ref misses something or even makes a mistake in judgment (ie quick 5 second count and not allowing the TO in the Texas/Ariz game), but apparently the ref didn’t even know the rule here. Or at least how to interpret it correctly. That’s just pathetic and yet another black eye for NCAA officiating. Who knows if we would have won, but we would have had possession to go up, and MU wouldn’t have had the full 35 seconds to work it around for a good shot even if we didn’t score.
Maybe the NCAA needs to investigate the use of replay a little more. Maybe in Tourney games, they can go to the monitor in the final 2 minutes to check certain things. Not that it would have helped us since the ref didn’t know the rule, but to help avoid some disastrous mistake. This isn’t the old days when the use of replay wasn’t possible. Utilize the technology and make sure calls are correct.
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on Mar 22, 2011 11:01 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
why isn't this news anywhere else?
I know it wasn’t as egregious and the impact not as obvious as the Rutgers/St Johns game, but this story isn’t on ESPN.com at all
"We don't lose hat and t-shirt games" - Tedy Bruschi
Yeah, that's annoying
There was a NYT article today talking about how many games had the outcome decided by (player) goofs — it even mentions the over and back call — but if I remember correctly, it didn’t say anything about the officiating.
Other people look, Andy Rautins can SEE.
by FatK44 on Mar 23, 2011 11:47 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Our boys got beat
plain and simple. Even if the call was wrong who’s to say we even score on that possesion. Still doesnt excuse all the turnovers, which I feel is the real reason why there’ll be no trip to Newark.
Think about Lax. Get pumped for the spring game (seriously… whens the last time someone said that?). Don’t dwell on a crappy call. It took me years to get over Moten’s timeout. Trust me, Orange faithful, it isn’t worth losing sleep on. We’re loaded next season. Concetrate on that!
I don't disagree with the sentiment in your post...
but in a game like college basketball (tournament basketball, no less) and with a team like we had, there’s no telling when one play shifts the momentum enough for one team or another to catch fire or lose steam. In my mind at the time, this was a pivotal turnover. A “last nail” kind of moment… If we don’t lose the ball, the fact is, you never know what would have happened. Who’s to say we even score on that possession… But who’s to say we don’t? The fact is we should have at least had the opportunity, and the NCAA admits as much.
It is Lacrosse Season, right?
Ok. Just checking. Seeing as how we still have the #1 team in the country…
I’m not really up in arms over this incorrect call. The team shouldn’t have been in a position to lose. Now can we just move on to the next sport (which we are really awesome at)…
Sorry Don't feed the Bulldog
This just makes it feel worse but it’s time to move on. It never should have come down to one or two plays against that team.
by moosedontbounce on Mar 23, 2011 10:10 AM EDT reply actions
Oh well
hopefully these guys will realize they have a lot of gettin better to do over the next year.
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