2003 team/player comparison
by bloodyyank44 on Jan 27, 2010 12:25 PM EST
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PrintPerhaps this subject has been discussed to death already, but lets compare this years team to the 2003 team. Since all know both teams were/are awesome, its only natural I suppose so here we go with the player-by-player breakdown:
Wes Johnson - Carmelo. Obviously because he is the best player, and a do-it-all type guy. Wes isn't a freshman, but this is his first and likely only year at SU. Also like 'melo, likely top-5 pick in the NBA draft and arguably the best player in college right now.
Andy Rautins - Kueth Duany. Rautins IMO is much better than Duany, but Duany was clearly a senior leader, fan-favorite and glue-guy. He could and did do whatever the team needed of him, just like Andy. Even when that meant stepping aside and letting others have the spotlight.
Brandon Triche - Gerry McNamara. While Brandon is not and will never be the shooter Gerry was, both are some of the best freshman PGs to set foot on the SU campus. Both were/are capable scorers and have played at a level thats well beyond their years. Also, Brandon is a local guy, and Gerry might as well be (much to the chagrin Syracuse fans and Kia dealers all over Scranton, PA).
AO - McNeil. While AO is a much better scorer, both are shorter, wide-body centers and remind me a lot of Otis Hill from the '96 team. And both suck at the FT line.
Rick Jackson - Tough call here, because no one from the '03 squad really fits. So I'm going with Craig-Nasty. Craig was a true center but seemed to play shorter than the 7' he actually was. Craig was reliable, but split time at center with McNeil. Similarly, Rick is a reliable scorer/rebounder, is shorter than 7' and splits time at center with AO.
Bench:
KJo - Hakim. The way Joseph has burst onto the scene this year as a sophomore is just as striking as Hak's breakout sophomore year in 2003. Both have a knack for getting around the rim, rebounding and throwing down some nice dunks. The fact that KJo is doing it as a bench player is even more amazing to me.
Scoop - Josh Pace. While Scoop is a PG, both bring that combination of depth/experience/talent to the team. Both are guys I have 100% faith in driving into the lane and scoring, but for some reason I'm still amazed at how consistent they were in that respect.
Mookie - Billey Edelin. Mook def. won't contribute in the 2nd half of the season that Billy did, but their the resident drama queens for their respective teams. In the end, that level of drama is a minor annoyance compared to other teams.
To top it off, both of these teams were grossly underrated from the beginning of the season, and caught fans and the media completely off-gaurd. But both teams showed steady improvement throughout the season. Both have capable and potential future stars as bench players. And most of all both teams have incredible balance between leadership, youth and star power. That beings said, March is still a ways off, but I think this years team might even be better than '03. Thoughts?
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superstitious much?
Seriously, if you’re too insecure to talk about how good this team might be, WTF is the point? This is as good of an SU team as we’ve ever seen and I for one have the balls to say it.
by bloodyyank44 on Jan 27, 2010 1:04 PM EST up reply actions
these guys are not stars and have never delt with stardom. Follow Jimmy B’s lead and keep them in the underdog roll as long as you can.
This is a very good TEAM
but dont mistake these players for future pro stars. The 03 team had several guys who could beat you off the dribble. This team looks like Brandon is the only one with a chance in an iso situation. Wes showed in his 7 TO preformance that he cant put the ball on the floor.
We have 2 good shooters. Wes and Andy. Neither one of those guys can create their own shot. We all want Wes to take over… but guess what, he cant! Hes not that type of player. He is a very skilled, blue collar glue guy who hasnt put it on the floor since he was 6’2.
Other teams respect Andy, Brandon and Scoop because they look to pass first so they dont play them as tight.
AO and Ricky are both loads on the low block, but neither is a threat to pull their defender outside. They work great TOGETHER because no team in the country has 2 guys who can match up with them. One always gets a mismatch.
They are a good TEAM because they work together to get other guys shots. They fit our system on D. Very long and very athletic. No one on this team with the exception of Andy would be a lock down defender in a man to man situation. Johnny seemed to let his ego trump the system last year when he wanted to play more man.
They are a very good TEAM. Much like the SYSTEM players in college football, they would not be as efficient on other teams. They know their rolls and execute. Jimmy B cant ask for more than that.
by ryanwk628 on Jan 27, 2010 1:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This team will only go far
if AO and RJ are playing tough. Not tough as in fouls…but tough as in taking space… grabbing the rebounds that are there to be rebounded… no foolish offensive turnovers… don’t let 6’2 guards knock the ball out of your hands… go up strong with the ball and dunk it… and if triple-teamed, don’t simply throw the ball off the backboard… look for the open guy.
All other issues resolve when these two are playing well. It opens things up for our shooters. We get easy hoops. We put the other team in foul trouble. We have fewer turnovers.
exactly
This is a great TEAM, which we haven’t had since 2003. Carmelo was obviously the star, but that team was so much more than just him. Clearly he is/was a better player than Wes, but even he had bad nights shooting from the floor and they still won 30 games in spite of that.
Those guys knew their roles just like this group does. Sure, there are plenty of weaknesses like you’ve pointed out. But they’ve overcome them. Every teams has them. But the incredible balance on this team and the 2003 team overcomes that. And regardless of what weaknesses Wes has, he’s still a lock for the lottery. If he’s not a star at the college level, I don’t know who is. And I could care less if he “takes over” a game. He doesn’t need to, and if he ever did, we’re sucking. Also, if KJo continues to improve like we’ve seen so far, look out.
As for the 2003 team having “several” guys that could beat you off the dribble I completely disagree. They were better in that respect, but the only guy who was consistent all season was ‘melo. As far as outside shooting, Gerry and Melo were the only good shooters and were good at creating their shot. But Andy and Wes’ percentage is much higher. This after pushing the line back, which makes shot creation more difficult in the end.
You brought up a good point about defense. This team is also as well equipped to run the zone as any we’ve seen in awhile. The zone we saw in 2003 had as much to do with winning it all as anything else. I hope we don’t have to see M2M the rest of the year- the only reason Jimmy would switch is if we are behind and need to try to create quick TO’s.
My point here is if you can’t have fun and enjoy whats happening RIGHT NOW, why bother watching until March? The secret is out, this team is very good. I’m glad for once we are one of the top dogs and not the underdog. We’ll have plenty of time to be underdogs again, trust me. Jimmy B may want to keep their ego’s in check and thats fine. What I see is a team that is incredibly confident without the massive egos and I’m sure nothing you or I say will change that. But as fans, you might as well buckle up and enjoy the ride. Every once in awhile its ok for us to believe the hype, esp. when we are in the midst of one of the best TEAMS we’ve seen in a long time.
"You heard it out of my mouth,If we get the No. 3 seed, get your Final Four tickets." - Carmelo Anthony
by bloodyyank44 on Jan 27, 2010 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
We
just had our best comeback since the ‘03 OK St. tourney game. That’s how I know this team CAN be something special. We haven’t done enough yet to say that we ARE special. The ’99-00 team was the last undefeated team in the country and we just faltered so much down the stretch. Just too early to be thinking big picture.
After we finish the regular season we can definitely start dreaming big things. Let’s focus our energy on the next month for now.
Without Gerry McNamara we wouldn't have won 10 f-- games, not 10
agreed
the game at Georgetown scares me the most. I know we just wiped the floor with them but that was with our crowd and on our floor.
But we also have UConn and ‘Nova left to visit here, so let’s get to March 1 before we start putting together “One shining moment” montages.
I think Mookie is going to surprise us
I think he’ll see more and more time. Wes has been playing 40 minutes a game. We simply can’t keep doing that. An 8 man rotation would be really good, especially when the 8th guy shoots 46% from downtown. He also hustles, is a decent rebounder. And I don’t think his defense is that bad.
I applaud you for deciding to start McNeil and have Warrick come off the bench, since that happened, you know, zero times during the 2002-03 season.
Solid work though.
Thbbbbbbbbbbbt. (<—fart noise)
Well, no shit
That wasn’t the point genius. Point is the guy on this years team most like Warrick doesn’t even start.
"You heard it out of my mouth,If we get the No. 3 seed, get your Final Four tickets." - Carmelo Anthony
by bloodyyank44 on Jan 27, 2010 5:18 PM EST up reply actions
No comparison
These are two totally different teams. Like everyone is saying this team isn’t based on individual ability, it’s based on passing and getting everyone an extra shot so i;m not sure what comparing players proves.
That 2003 team had a once in a generation college player in Carmelo. Wes Johnson has a long way to go to even come close to equaling anything Carmelo did. Melo’s game was so polished from day one it was frightening.
The one thing everyone should worry about is whether this team has a go to guy. Who’s taking that shot down 2 with 10 seconds left? Rautins off a pick? Johnson with no real dribbling skills? Triche or Jardine off the bounce? I would like to see the Cuse play a real nailbiter here before comparing them to anyone.
When the 2003 team got in trouble you knew Melo could take it over (See Michigan State, Notre Dame and the NCAA tourney). There’s no one here that can do that. Let’s hope they don’t need it.
Comparing players proves nothing, its just a fun excerise to see how we stack up. Of course Wes is not ‘Melo, but they are the respective star players for each team. Sure, Melo was the guy in ’03 that could take over the game. The fact that we don’t need Wes to be that type of guy is a great thing.
I’ll take Rautins to take the last shot. Guy came up big in 6OT last year and has hit some big shots this year. He’s the guy I’d look for, we’ll see what happens if/when we get there.
"You heard it out of my mouth,If we get the No. 3 seed, get your Final Four tickets." - Carmelo Anthony
by bloodyyank44 on Jan 27, 2010 4:45 PM EST up reply actions
Agree
Remember early this year at MSG how many tide turning shots he hit? Also, I wouldn’t feel too uncomfortable with Wes shooting the last shot. The guy is hitting 44% from 3 pt range.
Best to put the ball in your best player’s hands at the end of the game, but Rautins is also a stone cold killa at times.
Without Gerry McNamara we wouldn't have won 10 f-- games, not 10
by PoetryInMoten on Jan 27, 2010 6:17 PM EST up reply actions
SU Team better than 03' Team!
This years squad in my opinion is better than the 03’ squad and that’s saying a lot. Nobody on this team is as talented as Melo was. But the supporting cast is better, more chemistry, and much better defense. Again, this is saying a lot because the 03’ team was awesome. I just think this years squad is much more dynamic. Look at where this years team is as far as wins / losses and look at the 03’ record at this point. And we’re playing more games this year than back in 03’ too. The guys just like the guys back in 03’ like each other and enjoy each other’s company. Wes could be a ball hog in order to win the Wooden award but the guy could care less. He’s more concerned with what’s best for the team. If he has a chance to shoot the ball but see’s KJo underneath or outside wide open he dishes to him to get the easy bucket. That say’s alot. SU is going to Indy this year and nobody can deny us!!!! Go Cuse!!!!
Matt
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